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Post by Ana Ng on Dec 16, 2001 1:15:19 GMT -5
So tell me, are you pro- or anti-Vic? I know there were many fans who didn't care for Vic's character, but I liked him!
I've even downloaded Vic singing "The Way You Look Tonight" from WYLB.
And of course, one of Vic's tunes set a chilling setting for "The Siege of AR-558" (Was it 558? or 553? I don't remember!)
So, what was your reaction to Vic?
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Post by Sabel on Dec 16, 2001 4:03:34 GMT -5
I enjoyed the character of Vic. You are right that a lot of people do not like him, but to each his own. Heck, I enjoyed the "funny" Ferengi episodes as well.
Vic's little casino served a valuable purpose to the people stationed on DS9. Those were terrible and stressful times. Sure, they could go hang out at Quark's for relaxation, but that was still reality.
They were in a war not only for their lives, but for the future of the Galaxy. Vic's place gave them a hangout where they could all escape into a little fantasy, get away from the pressure of The Dominion for just a little while. I liked that idea much better than them individually running off to holosuites to relax.
Vic helped to bond them. His music helped to soothe their troubled souls in a bad time. Throughout history, soldiers have always turned to music as an escape from the horrors of war(Tommy Dorsey in WWII, The Doors/Hendrix/The Who/etc. during Vietnam and they still do it today). The fact that the "soldiers" of Starfleet needed a place to hang out and listen to relaxing music is historically accurate.
I enjoyed his singing.
Remember when part of the crew had gotten trapped on the planet where Starfleet was trying to crack into the Dominion message relay. The Jem'Hadar were everywhere, Starfleet had sufferred great losses and things looked bleak. Then, as they were preparing for the Jem'Hadar charge and their possible deaths, the music of Vic began to play. It calmed them, stealed their resolve and reminded them what they were fighting for.
Nog lost a leg in that battle, Quark had to kill and Bashir proved that he was a soldier as well as a doctor. That episode is one of my favorites and the music of Vic is an interegal part.
Worf and Julian sitting in his casino listening to him sing " Here's one for the losers" Those are classic DS9 moments.
No, (IMO) if you take away Vic, you take away a valuable part of DS9, just as if you took away the "funny" Ferengi episodes. It all added up to make a great series!
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Post by Mentat_Tir on Dec 16, 2001 16:20:44 GMT -5
I liked Vic the first epi he was seen in “His Way.” But liked him less with each consecutive episode. Here are some reasons: 1. Vic “slowed up the action.” I’m not sure why we were forced to hear Vic’s entire performances of “Come Fly with Me” and “You’re Nobody Till Somebody Loves You.” It’s like the writers only wrote 30 minutes of plot and had to fill in that extra airtime with a song or two. 2. Quark would not let Vic go on. In one epi, someone said that Quark did not like Vic because he considered him “competition.” After seeing how Quark deals with competition (think Club Martus from “Rivals”), don’t you think that Vic’s program might have a “little accident?” 3. Wasn’t there a war on? I know what you’re going to say. The DS9 crew had time between duty shifts to relax with Vic. Maybe so, but between Vics, the Alamo, Quark’s, playing baseball with Vulcans and whatever else our hero’s did in their off-time, it’s no wonder they were losing the war for so long. 4. Vic was just too good. I recall a classic line from TNG’s “Hide and Q” where Tasha says, “Sir, how can Q handle time and space so well and us so badly?” Picard replied, “Perhaps we’ll find one day that time and space are simpler than the human equation.” Well, heck, if Data knew that Felix could program a computer to be an expert in interpersonal communication and relationships, why is he having such a tough time with it? I don't know. Most of all, I just don't think Vic fit into the Star Trek universe. But that's my opinion.
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Post by Andorian_Incident on Dec 17, 2001 6:19:47 GMT -5
It's not so much that I dislike the character of Vic, but at times, like Mentat said, he seemed to slow down the episode and there was no need to have such long winded songs. Other than that, I think the character was okay--better than some of the other recurring characters.
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PreatorX
NCC 1701-A
Infinite Tribble free days!!!
Posts: 194
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Post by PreatorX on Dec 17, 2001 8:51:57 GMT -5
Mentat_Tir you forget something, Quark gets paid for use of the Vic Fontain programme. It's his holosuite, others pay to use it.
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Post by Mentat_Tir on Dec 17, 2001 9:10:36 GMT -5
Mentat_Tir you forget something, Quark gets paid for use of the Vic Fontain programme. It's his holosuite, others pay to use it. That's a good point, SantaX. I didn't think about that. If Quark computed that he was making more profit by renting holosuite time, he would let Vic go.
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Post by Technomage on Jan 16, 2002 4:20:38 GMT -5
I thought Vic Fontaine was ok, but I think they over-exposed him a bit. He should only be used as an interesting diversion and not feature as a main character. But he does have a good voice, assuming he can actually sing, of course. One other point though, why does a holo-character age at the same rate as the real-life characters - shouldn't he always look the same? ;D Ok, I'm nitpicking, but it is kind of funny.
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Post by Elric3960 on Jan 27, 2002 1:12:48 GMT -5
I thought Vic Fontaine was ok...he does have a good voice, assuming he can actually sing, of course. I'm assuming that this is a comment on his singing ability and not a serious question that it was really James Darren singing and not lip-synching. I can't be the only one here that knows that Darren has been a popular singer as well as actor for over 40 years! I know I'm old, but c'mon!Perhaps that's a reflection of how his "real life" modern-day counterparts, Frank Sinatra and Paul Anka, have sounded the same over the years but aged physically. I liked Vic. To me, he was a metaphor of a bygone age: the tinsel and phoney glamour of the '60's nightclub scene. Vic took the potentially two-dimensionality that he was literally trapped in and gave it with a touch of class. This was reminiscent of the EMH in "that other show," the program exceeding its programming.
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Post by Technomage on Jan 27, 2002 2:44:53 GMT -5
OK, I wasn't sure that he was actually singing, but I did think that if he wasn't, then he was doing a d**n fine job of lipsynching.
As you said, his style is very nice and I would rather listen to him singing, than nearly any of the latest crop of 'singers' we have to put up with. ;D
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Post by UltimateTrekker on Jan 28, 2002 9:19:15 GMT -5
Just watched "His Way" for the first time and was reminded of WHY I loved DS9
The scene with Kira/Odo
K: We should discuss it tonight, over dinner.
O: Oh, dinner, and then what?
I don't know, maybe we should go dancing.
Then I suppose you'd want me to kiss you.
Maybe
Then why bother with dinner, why don't I kiss you right now!
Fine!
(The kiss, right in the middle of the Promenade.) Such a refresshing, funny scene. No technobable, no "I'm a perfect human" speech. Just people, REAL people (even if one's a Bajorn and the other is a shapeshifter from another quatrant of the galaxy..)
And Vic was GREAT in that episode. Real class. It was a turn for the "Classical" music of TNG which was good but always made us ask... Doesn't anyone consider Stephen King, Tom Clancy, The Beatles, or The Stones to be "Classic" 400 years from now???
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Post by Elric3960 on Jan 28, 2002 12:05:22 GMT -5
I enjoyed "His Way" as well. Particularly that scene that UT described.
I also enjoyed hearing Nana Visitor as a holographic construct of a nightclub singer who "looked like Kira." She has a lovely singing voice! I knew that she was a trained dancer but I didn't know about her singing ability. Not since Peggy Lee first sang "Fever" was I so moved by that song.
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Post by UltimateTrekker on Jan 28, 2002 12:09:37 GMT -5
Off topic, but I was quite "moved" when Kelly Bundy danced to Fever on Married... With Children.
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Post by Elric3960 on Jan 28, 2002 12:14:15 GMT -5
You're such a romantic, UT!
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Post by UltimateTrekker on Jan 28, 2002 12:37:36 GMT -5
Actually, I loved that bit some much, I called Ezri over to the computer to watch it. yes the computer.
How else do you think I see all my Star Trek? Waiting for them to air on TV? Do you realize how long it takes to see an episode from season 3 when their airing season 4 at the rate of 1 episode per week? 3 years. That's right. 3 years!
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Post by Ana Ng on Jan 29, 2002 0:24:36 GMT -5
::twitches::...tries to refrain from spouting off more from the DS9 companion book... fails miserably.. Ahem, anyway! Interesting side notes on "His Way". It's described by Ira Behr, I believe as "as perfect an episode as we ever made". As for "the kiss", they ended up using the first take of it, and didn't shoot anymore. Why? Because the forcefulness of the kiss broke Rene Auberjonois's Odo mask! He would have to go through makeup all over again, and they liked the first take as it was Also: The writers had picked out a song besides "Fever" for Nana Visitor to sing, but she suggested it, since her mother was friends with Peggy Lee as a child and when she went to visit her with her mother, Ms. Lee sang the song, and little Nana was entranced, thinking that there had never breathed a more elegant and beautiful woman, and wanted to be just like that when she grew up. So, singing "Fever" was fulfilling a childhood fantasy for Ms. Visitor. Interesting, no?
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