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Post by Christina on Feb 20, 2002 15:08:48 GMT -5
Threshold wasn't bad. I didn't see it as a spoof, and it certainly had some hilarious moments - Tom's dying wish, a pizza and a kiss from Kes (he got neither).
And yes, the Chakotay/Tuvok exchange at the end. LOL
Macrocosm. Well, a ripping yarn (marred only by my personal opinion that it should have been Chakotay ripping off his uniform to go kick some alien behind).
11.59 - the millennium episode (a year too early like all the rest of them) that showed you can't believe everything your parents tell you about your forebears........
Counterpoint had it's tense moments - who was playing whom like a finely tuned violin?
And the Chute was great acting - and the start point for a GENUINE P/K possibility..............which naturally the writers and producers totally wimped out of.
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Post by Tyax on Feb 22, 2002 4:31:40 GMT -5
I can't believe that nobody has mentioned that Concerning Flight was in their list! It has to be the worst of them all! And of course 11.59 is very close behind it. You all see to hate Threshold but I actually found it to be alright and as for Counter Point I thought it was one of the best and even Kate Mulgrew considers that to be one of the best.
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Tpol
NCC 1701
Space is Very Big Captain.....
Posts: 74
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Post by Tpol on Feb 22, 2002 5:09:19 GMT -5
When Sky one had a Star trek night last year, The Captains favourites had a poll and Counterpoint was voted the best.
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Post by Peter_Pevensie on Feb 22, 2002 6:42:19 GMT -5
I can't believe that nobody has mentioned that Concerning Flight was in their list! Oh yes, Tyax...good catch. The only thing this episode had going for it was the fact that it was only 47 minutes long. It wasn't bad, per say, but it was boring.
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Post by UltimateTrekker on Feb 22, 2002 8:37:57 GMT -5
I mention counterpoint BECAUSE Mulgrew liked it so much. To me in is the incarnation of what I didn't like about the character, and for the actress to say she loved proves that she too was with the writers in the Bi-Polar Captain Syndrome. (I've said it before and I'll say it again. Watch Thirdy Days, THEN Counterpoint (the next aired episode) to see HOW Bi-Polar Janeway was) (Edit) as for Concerning Flight, I agree. It was so bad I think we all forgot it. Complete unmemorable.. isn't that the one where DaVincie steals to mobel emiter, and then some other aliens steal it, and he rides a bike....
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Post by Peter_Pevensie on Feb 22, 2002 9:51:45 GMT -5
...she too was with the writers in the Bi-Polar Captain Syndrome...see HOW Bi-Polar Janeway was... I have a very good friend who has diagnosed bi-polar disorder, and it always irks me a bit when people label the Janeway character with it. Trust me, Janeway shows absoultely none of the symptoms of this legitimate phychological disorder. She may have handled situations and events in an inconsistent manner (and as a Voyager fan I'm willing to concede that she did), but that is NOT a symptom of bi-polar disorder.
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Post by UltimateTrekker on Feb 22, 2002 10:00:22 GMT -5
Hey, my Uncle too has Bi-Polar and my mother (as a RN, not a gooney mother that she is) has also warned me to be careful of it myself.
I, of course, did not try to say that Janeway WAS bi-polar (if so, I'd excuse her since her actions WERE in character) I mearly meant to say that her actions and morals many times completely reverse themselves from show to show.
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Post by Peter_Pevensie on Feb 22, 2002 13:21:28 GMT -5
I, of course, did not try to say that Janeway WAS bi-polar... Then you probably shouldn't have said, "Watch Thirdy Days, THEN Counterpoint (the next aired episode) to see HOW Bi-Polar Janeway was." ;D In other words, that she "handled situations and events in an inconsistent manner?" ;D As stated above, you'll get little argument out of me there. But, idiot that I am, I liked the show anyway. Sorry, UT...we seem to have been locking horns a lot today. It's my fault; I've been lurking in on the latest little insurrection attempt at TrekBBS and it's got me in a bad mood. I think I'm just going to drop all these threads and pretend like today never happened.
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Post by UltimateTrekker on Feb 22, 2002 14:50:38 GMT -5
It doesn't help that I have a tendancy to exagerate a lot to prove my points. Then I get angry when people take me serisously.
Happens all the time at home
"I don't feel like sitting in bed trying to coax Gavin to sleep for 3 hours."
"It was only 15 minutes," yells Ezri
"I KNOW, I was making a point!"
That's a common fight.
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Post by Katatak47 on Feb 25, 2002 16:23:13 GMT -5
Well, I actually like most all of the episodes listed above as 'bad', each for different reasons, so..... And I have particular affinities for both "Counterpoint" and "11:59" as well-written and acted episodes. But that's just me. As for worst Voyager episode, I believe that title truly belongs either to "Favorite Son" - gag! or "Nightingale" -- and no, not because these were Garrett Wang featured stories. Just because I consider both of those truly unwatchable after the first or dreaded second viewing. Another close contender is "Alice". Zzzzzzzzzzz
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Post by UltimateTrekker on Feb 26, 2002 9:35:06 GMT -5
I know I may be beating this, but something else hit me about Counterpoint is that it seems to have been written in the opposite fashion as most good TNG eps were. Let me 'splain. Most TNG (that I find good... Best of Both Worlds, Second Chances) were written without knowing the ending. They came up with a situation (Picard assimilate, 2 Rikers) and started writing. This allowed the CHARACTERS to drive the action. (What WOULD Troi do if another Riker, still in love with her, showed up at her doorstep?) With many Voyager eps I noticed THIS pattern. "It would be cool to have Janeway save the day by doing this... OK, let's start with that and then try to figure out how to get her to that position" The seemed to write backwards and MAKE the characters do what was needed to get them into that situation. Couterpoint is a PERFECT example. WHY was Janeway hiding telepaths? I can understand her own people, but harboring others? Sure, they would go to prison, but that isn't their issue, and it's a direct violation of the PD (remember, that it protect ALL cultures, not just pre-warp.. Don't believe me? Watch TNG's Redemption) I'll stop now
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Post by Christina on Feb 26, 2002 9:42:05 GMT -5
Its a very valid point. Do go on.
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Post by UltimateTrekker on Feb 26, 2002 12:00:32 GMT -5
Basically that IS the point. I would accept it that she was doing it because it was part of HER moral values, but in Thirty Days, an entire (and VERY unique) race is set to destroy itself. Tom tries to intercede with actions that WILL save them, but it's against the PD, so Janeways stops him. Some moral values.
Addition, I blame the writers for this, NOT Mulgrew, but that doesn't mean I like her portrayal, but I just don't blame her for incontinuity.
I keep bringing this up becuase I feel it really says it all about the series as a whole and what problems it has. And, I'm not the only one... check out the Braga quote.
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Post by Christina on Feb 26, 2002 13:56:56 GMT -5
Interesting quote. At least they tried to find a character for Janeway, or two or three.
They gave up completely with Chakotay...
cries of shame shame from the Estrogen Gallery.
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Post by UltimateTrekker on Apr 18, 2002 8:38:44 GMT -5
Ok, so I FINALLY saw Threshold.... ... ... ... So, in the 24th century, we can whipe away 90% of our body (that is about 40 percent of it's previous size) we can regenerate the rest of our bodies (including hair lenght and style?) Amazing... ooo, and so the theory of evolution (in the future) is that we make crazy changes that in no way inhance our ability to survive (Like not being able to speak, forcing ourselves to walk on all fours, removing the use of tools from posibility and shortening our legs to make movement more difficult.....) And also it occurs within the body with no need of reprodution... interesting indeed. BTW, if they were able to just infuse them with radiation to bring them back to normal, whey don't they just abandon Voyager and take that shuttle to earth, drop off the cure and 10 people, then make another 15 trips. Send techs later to fix Voyager up. RESET BUTTON!
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